April 1, 2025

The Cash-Flow Investor with Kevin Bupp

The Cash-Flow Investor with Kevin Bupp
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Kevin Bupp is a seasoned commercial real estate investor with over $1 billion in transactions. Kevin discusses his journey from buying his first single-family home at age 20 to founding Sunrise Capital Investors. The focus is on his strategies in mobile home parks and parking facilities, reflecting on lessons from past financial crises and the importance of staying within one's lane. They also explore the potential of AI and the current real estate market, particularly in Florida and other states. Kevin emphasizes the value of long-term investments and diversification in dynamic real estate sectors.

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Host Information:

Luis Hernandez: Facebook, Instagram, LinkedIn, Twitter

email: thewayfindershow@gmail.com

We want to give a huge shout out to our friend, Jast Collum at 756 Productions, for creating our intro and outro music. This guy is a beast.

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I think that there's a, there's a 1,000,001 different ways to make money in real estate.

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I don't think that there's any right or wrong way.

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You and I both know many people in the industry that do different things than what we do, and they do quite well, right?

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Yeah.

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They're kinda masters of their own craft.

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However, I would say that we try to stay our lane.

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It's, I've, some people do it really well, but I've never been great at, at doing many things and, and being excellent at all them at the same time.

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And so that, that's why.

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We focused on mobile home parks for many years before we ever even considered another asset class.

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Welcome to the Wayfinder Show with Louis Hernandez, where guests discuss the why and how of making changes that led them down a more authentic path or allow them to level up in some areas of their life.

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Our goal is to dig deep and provide not only knowledge, but actionable advice to help you get from where you are to where you want to be.

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Come join us and find a way to your dream life.

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Welcome back to the Wayfinder Show.

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I'm your host Louis Hernandez, and today I'm thrilled to welcome Kevin Bup to the show.

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Kevin is a seasoned commercial real estate investor with over$1 billion in transactions under his belt.

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He's the author of the Cashflow Investor and host of the Top Rated Real Estate Investing for Cash Flow podcast.

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As the founder of Sunrise Capital Investors, Kevin is passionate about help helping passive investors achieve financial freedom by focusing on high performing assets like mobile home parks and parking facilities with decades of experience at Insights featured on platforms like BiggerPockets and the best CRE show, Kevin is here to share his expertise in identifying top investment opportunities in today's market.

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Kevin, welcome to the Wayfinder Show.

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Hey Louis.

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Thanks for having me.

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I'm excited to be here.

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I.

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Yeah, we're excited to have you.

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So Kevin, let's let's start out a little bit about your journey.

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What's your origin story?

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Where are you from?

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How'd you get to where you are?

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That kind of thing.

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Yeah.

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No, sure, sure thing.

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So I've I always joke and say I've, never had a real job.

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I I got started in real estate at a young age.

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Got introduced to it at 19, bought my first single family investment at the age of 20.

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And it really just followed that, that similar trajectory was following a mentor of mine.

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And just building a single family and small multifamily portfolio of rental properties, in the first six or so years found some good, momentum at scale.

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And in my my mid twenties had built up a portfolio of about 120 single family homes and wow, a few hundred apartment doors and and was doing really well at least on paper.

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And ultimately oh eight happened.

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I was living in, I live in Florida now.

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I was down in Tampa Bay area and own everything I had down here.

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And Florida was, one of the ground zero spots for, the crash.

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And ultimately real estate became, the market became incredibly challenging in a very short period of time down here.

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And so just really found myself, running damage control and just working through loan modifications and dean lose and just a challenging.

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Roughly three years of, my life from oh eight to oh 11.

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And then basically came back in and had to rebuild had to figure out a better way better way to to make the mousetrap and ultimately fast forward to where I'm at today.

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So I during that period, I got introduced to another asset class, which is mobile home parks.

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It's, one asset class that we still focus, on today.

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It's our primary focus.

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Bought that first mobile home park back in 2000, late 2011.

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And then ultimately found success with that and bought a sack in a third or fourth, the fifth.

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And fast forward to today we've, got about 350 million of assets under management in our portfolio and most of it being manufactured housing.

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And then we also have one other vertical that we specialize in, and that's parking.

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So parking lots and parking garages and strategic locations across the country.

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That was a very condensed version.

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I've been at this SN for over 20 years full time.

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This is all.

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All I do, we've got a wonderful team and we built some we've been involved with some really special and amazing projects and have a lot of fun doing it too.

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That, I think that's the most important aspect, right?

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Enjoy what you do and you never have a day at work.

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With that, again, that's my 20 plus year story of of being an investor.

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And it's been a fun ride.

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Yeah.

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Yeah.

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I, remember the oh eight era.

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It has defined you you've, been much more resilient, jumped back at it and, obviously it shows success.

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I, I I spent quite a bit of time recovering from that as well.

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The I was in Baltimore and I remember going down to Denver to Tampa to Florida, actually during that time and just seeing like whole communities that were in the mid.

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Middle of getting built up and all of a sudden they were just like left abandoned there.

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Big subdivisions and such.

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Lots of that.

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Amazing.

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Yeah.

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Yeah that was the biggest, issue there was obviously the, loans were very easy to obtain back then.

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Lots of subprime loans.

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You had no, no income, no dock loans.

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Yeah.

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And if you could fall ga mirror, you could go buy four houses, right?

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And that was the, and so there was builders that were building tens of thousands of rooftops for really a population wasn't here.

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It was just really Hot potato Hot potato.

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And then when the music stopped, there were, there was an, a massively excess, a large excess supply of of housing units.

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And then on top of that a lot of the, a lot of the employment down here during those boom years was fueled by construction work or revolved around the real estate space.

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And so when, housing stopped, guess what?

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A lot of the jobs went away and folks had to move and find new occupations or careers, or go to a new, literally leave Florida and go somewhere else where there's a little bit more job stability.

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And so not only did we have a massive amount of excess supply of, rooftops, we also saw a out migration of population for a period of time.

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And so it was pretty nasty for many years.

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But as far as the resiliency, man I literally, I, three years of, I ran, I managed this kind of damage control for three years trying to figure shit out and yeah.

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And I wouldn't say that I, immediately bounced back.

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It was a my first, the first property I bought I, my credit was gone.

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It was many years went by, probably six years went by without me even looking at my credit score.

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'cause it was in the, was horrific eye judgment, things like that.

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Judgments.

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I was working through liens.

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I tried to work with all my creditors and try again.

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It was many, years of trying to work through that while I tried to figure out a way to rebuild.

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But it didn't come quick.

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We started buying properties, but it was a, using the last penny I had had to make it work.

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And trying to figure it out.

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Back then, everything was still distressed, we were buying stuff.

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But Jo the unemployment is still high.

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Jobs were still tough to come by, right?

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And so it wasn't a, it wasn't an easy go, even buying things at a discount, it still wasn't an easy go we had to fight tooth and nail to to get this properties to cash flow and to to, hold onto'em for long term.

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But it I'm happy where we're at today.

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It's.

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It's definitely helped me build who I am and really reshape my character as an individual and definitely wouldn't trade it for the world.

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So lots of, good lessons learned during those challenging times.

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Yeah, totally.

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I'm wondering if you see any, with having gone through that, makes you really wise, right?

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Like you, you just have a lot of experience that you just learn about that you can't read you about you have to experience to, to really learn.

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And with that in mind, I'm wondering what you're seeing with today's market, right?

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You said out migration from Florida.

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I can't imagine people even imagining that now you, Florida's been a top market right?

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In this country for probably the last, I dunno, five to 10 years, right?

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And yeah.

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And it seems to continue that way.

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That's all we read about.

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How are you seeing any signs of anything turning at all?

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As far as speaking to Florida, no Florida's incredibly sound it's got a, it's a much more diverse economic base than what it was back then.

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It's a night and day difference.

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As far as and obviously there's a, lot of markets within Florida, the state of Florida, so the major ones being the Tampa Bay area, Orlando, Miami, and Jacksonville.

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But all incredibly resilient areas.

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Lots of lots of employers that have moved their operations to Florida.

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So again, just for a litany of reasons Florida's a very sound and solid place.

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We still have quite a bit of population trying to make their way here.

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We have no state income tax.

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There's a lot of benefit in the weather's pretty amazing too.

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I don't see Florida slowing down anytime soon.

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We've got, unreasonably low inventory on the market.

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I know a lot of, lots of areas are dealing with that same thing.

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But it's just, there's there's more folks that are trying to move here than move away.

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So it's it's, a positive thing all the way around.

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So I definitely don't see any stress cracks in Florida as a whole, and even the major submarkets I've mentioned there.

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And prices are still, pricing is still incredibly tight.

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Whether you talk about residential or commercial, still a lot of capital that's trying to find its way into these, various markets within Florida.

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And so again, I don't see that changing anytime soon, but I'm not an economist, all I can see is, what I see and and what I feel and just being in the immediate marketplace and, it's still incredibly strong.

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Yeah.

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I would argue with not being an economist probably makes you more qualified to your opinion, but what about, what, what got you into mobile homes and, parking, let's take one of them at a time.

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Why mobile homes?

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Yeah.

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I've always been in residential real estate.

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Residential is just fairly easy for me to understand.

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Everyone needs a roofer over their head, right?

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It's one of our basic needs.

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And and so I understood when I own a few hundred houses, most of them were a they were work workforce type houses in the lower end neighborhoods.

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Not lower quality, but just lower end demographic as far as the income standpoint.

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And and so I just, I was always very comfortable in that space.

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And so I had never considered mobile home parks.

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It just accidentally fell on my radar.

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When I was going through the rebuild phase sorry, really 2011 when I was okay, version two, how do we do this better?

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The second time around I I did identify that I didn't really want to go the route of buying a bunch of single family homes.

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Again, I I'd identified some, inefficiencies in that business model and just felt that buying multi-families, which I own a number of as well, was just a better way to scale and to you have to get to a certain critical scale as well before you can really start affording to hire staff.

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Yeah.

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And and when I was building a single family home portfolio, literally I ended up building it up to about just shy of 40 units by myself and I was running ragged, I'm like, I'm not doing that again.

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And I didn't really have the actual, I didn't have the funds to go out and build the team first before I.

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Built the portfolio.

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And so I felt multifamily was gonna be the easier way.

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I can just go buy one or two 30, 40 unit properties and quickly get to a scale where I could start bringing some some teammates in to help run the organization.

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And so during that time, I went, I went through this explore exploratory phase.

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This is starting in early 2011 where I just went out the market had really changed, the landscape had changed.

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Everything was different from oh eight to oh 11, and when I say from oh eight to 2011 when I was running damage control my, portfolio and I was managing that crisis, I wasn't paying attention to anything else that was going on in the world, right?

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Things were crumbling, the economy was in really rough shape.

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But I just, I wasn't keeping my finger on the pulse of the real estate market or what did funding look like nowadays you know what were loan terms.

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I literally, I wasn't paying attention to any of that stuff.

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And so when it came time to reinvent myself.

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If I needed to understand what was happening out there, right?

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What's real world, the people that are actually that own multi-family, the people that are in the areas I wanna buy in.

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Like how are they managing how what did occupancy look like?

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What were rents like what were some considerations?

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Or, like things like concessions.

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Were those still being given out?

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And so I went on this mission to meet as many people as I could that are still in the space.

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And during that, timeframe, I was introduced by a good friend of mine to a gentleman by the name of Randy.

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And Randy just happened to be like a commercial banker for 30 years of his career.

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And had, recently retired.

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I literally just was introduced to Randy,'cause Randy knows a lot of people.

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So my buddy's Hey, go meet Randy.

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Go have lunch with, he's a cool dude.

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He's got good stories.

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And he's, been a banker for 30 years.

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Good, person to know.

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And I had lunch with Randy and found out that he owned a couple of mobile home parks.

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So he, his last 10 plus years of his banking career, a lot of his clients here in Florida own mobile home parks.

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And so he made the comment to me of I found myself in the wrong side of the closing statement or the wrong side of that p and l, right?

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Like I saw how much money my clients were making for 10 years.

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And so I he's like, when I retired, I made the decision that I was gonna go buy a couple parks as my retirement.

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And and he did, and I met him about two years after he had retired, bought a couple parks and and he just, he's the first person I had ever met that owned mobile home parks.

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And he started selling me all the beautiful things about the asset class.

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And he was really trying to make comparison to, I.

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Mobile home parks to to traditional multifamily.

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'cause he knew that, that, was what my focus was as as I worked towards rebuilding.

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And yeah.

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Anyway, long story short, I had two hour lunch meeting with him and he spoke probably an hour and a half of that about mobile home parks and how great they were.

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And I was so excited and I was so intrigued about the asset class.

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And I literally left that lunch meeting and I made a commitment to myself that I was gonna go buy a mobile home park and, see whether or not it was as great as what Randy had said it was.

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And so I did that.

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I there wasn't a lot of information out there, there weren't any podcasts on the topic.

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There was a few select random books, but there just wasn't a lot of information out in the marketplace like there is today.

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And and so I just really, what I did is I started calling on listings and I started going to look at parks and I started talking to brokers and, I started making offers.

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I got cold feet a bunch of times, got offers accepted, got cold feet.

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And I finally, just over a year from that point, I had lunch with Randy.

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I bought the first park.

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Bought asset up in Atlanta, Georgia.

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And Louis owned it up until about two and a half, two and a half, three years ago.

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But that was the first one.

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And the first one went well.

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Bought the second one, went well, bought the third, fourth so that's probably 50 parks ago.

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And it's been a fun ride ever since.

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So never planned on it, it was never part of the the grand plan to, buy mobile home parks.

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But it's been a great asset class and on top of that, it's, it truly is.

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I, I truly believe that it's the best and most affordable non-subsidized housing that exists today.

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In the market.

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Any market you take, any market where we own parks, I guarantee that we are by far by no means the lowest quality option.

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In fact, a lot of our work's incredibly nice, but I guarantee we are the most affordable option.

00:15:32.384 --> 00:15:40.214
If you compare two bedroom, two bath, a thousand square foot apartment to one of our, one of our homes or one of our communities, I guarantee ours is way nice.

00:15:40.913 --> 00:15:45.774
And it's probably about 25% less than what you pay to live in an apartment in the same area.

00:15:45.774 --> 00:15:58.703
So again, it's just a phenomenal value and really is a a a, a critical element of solving and making a debt in the affordable housing crisis.

00:15:58.703 --> 00:15:59.124
Yeah.

00:16:01.183 --> 00:16:03.024
I, don't know a lot about mobile homes.

00:16:03.053 --> 00:16:06.413
I grew up in the Northeast where there's just not many around to be found.

00:16:06.413 --> 00:16:13.524
But over time, obviously being in the space you, hear you, more of it, more of'em here in Colorado and such.

00:16:14.933 --> 00:16:19.073
But, I have seen it become incredibly popular in probably the last five years.

00:16:19.073 --> 00:16:27.173
I remember reading a Wall Street Journal article that talked about how there were these big operators and I think from after that just opened my eyes to a lot more about it.

00:16:27.443 --> 00:16:30.413
What are some differences in terms of the challenges?

00:16:30.653 --> 00:16:35.543
We have our stereotypes of, trailer parks and such, and.

00:16:36.384 --> 00:16:41.634
Obviously, and yeah, it seems like it's just another version of low income housing, right?

00:16:44.453 --> 00:16:49.374
At the end of the day mobile home parks are really, it's a different form of multifamily housing, right?

00:16:49.374 --> 00:16:49.433
Yeah.

00:16:49.614 --> 00:16:57.474
It's just horizontal instead of maybe a couple levels vertical, but really at the end of the day it really falls in the same bucket as, an apartment complex.

00:16:57.474 --> 00:16:58.854
It just comes in a different form.

00:17:00.173 --> 00:17:12.413
And so with that, a lot of folks, unfortunately, there is a stereotype and it all gets lumped into the bad stereotype of trailer trash drug, sex, rock and roll, like really just the, wrong elements.

00:17:12.413 --> 00:17:14.544
But it's, really the farthest from the truth.

00:17:15.263 --> 00:17:19.493
Again, you could pick any, market and pick let's use Denver as an example.

00:17:20.693 --> 00:17:26.784
There's really the wrong part of town where in that wrong part of town where you don't want to go the dangerous part of town.

00:17:26.784 --> 00:17:31.763
There's apartment complexes, there's single family houses, and there's probably a few mobile home parks here and there, right?

00:17:31.763 --> 00:17:33.923
And they all they truly are all that.

00:17:34.433 --> 00:17:36.324
You know that, that element that you don't want, right?

00:17:36.324 --> 00:17:36.325
Sure.

00:17:36.329 --> 00:17:37.703
You just, you probably don't wanna go there during the day.

00:17:37.703 --> 00:17:38.483
It's just dangerous, right?

00:17:38.483 --> 00:17:40.584
It's where all the drugs happen and, just crime and what have you.

00:17:40.584 --> 00:17:41.844
It's the wrong side of the railroad tracks.

00:17:42.983 --> 00:17:44.304
Then you take the middle class, right?

00:17:44.304 --> 00:17:49.104
Plenty of obviously blue collar, middle class neighborhoods, subdivisions in Denver.

00:17:50.183 --> 00:17:52.794
There's also apartment complexes in those areas of town.

00:17:53.064 --> 00:17:53.544
I can promise you.

00:17:53.544 --> 00:17:56.183
There's mobile home parks as well, and it's all very similar demographic.

00:17:56.874 --> 00:18:08.963
And then you take even the higher end stuff you take you got your white collar neighborhoods you've got your brand new, a class type apartment complexes that are catered to a certain demographic.

00:18:09.173 --> 00:18:21.834
And while it might not be the exact same demographic as a higher end mobile home park and maybe Denver's not a good example, but here in Florida and in Arizona, in the Sunbelt areas, there's a lot of what we like to classify as lifestyle communities.

00:18:21.834 --> 00:18:22.284
These are.

00:18:23.483 --> 00:18:24.953
These are mobile home parks.

00:18:24.953 --> 00:18:28.374
However, they're really they're a, master plan subdivision.

00:18:28.584 --> 00:18:34.763
They've got swimming pools, they've got clubhouses, they've got bocce ball, they've got pickleball courts, they've got all these things.

00:18:34.763 --> 00:18:34.943
Really?

00:18:35.124 --> 00:18:35.183
Wow.

00:18:35.308 --> 00:18:38.304
It's more of a master plan subdivision community.

00:18:38.304 --> 00:18:39.564
It just happens to be mobile homes.

00:18:39.564 --> 00:18:47.153
A lot of these, they're second homes for snowbirds that are, that live up north, but wanna place down south, wanna be around other folks maybe of their same age.

00:18:47.153 --> 00:18:55.493
And mobile home parks come in all forms, and they also serve all various levels of of income.

00:18:55.493 --> 00:19:00.983
And so it just happens that we all get lumped in that really low bucket of of the drugs, drug, sex, and rock and roll.

00:19:00.983 --> 00:19:02.604
And so that's just not the case.

00:19:03.354 --> 00:19:05.243
As far as I think the original question was.

00:19:06.923 --> 00:19:12.023
Maybe what's, what are some of the things that, that, you know, that we that, we feel really helped Mobile home parks kinda stand out?

00:19:12.023 --> 00:19:15.084
What stood out to us as as an asset class?

00:19:15.203 --> 00:19:19.253
What really intrigued us enough or intrigued me enough to like, go out and buy one?

00:19:19.433 --> 00:19:30.894
A couple of things that Randy had mentioned to me, which were quite interesting and, it's still very true, first and foremost, again, I'm gonna make the comparison to like a traditional multi-family rental units.

00:19:31.523 --> 00:19:33.413
Most of our residents actually own their own homes.

00:19:34.733 --> 00:19:37.374
They own their mobile home and they rent the land from us.

00:19:40.013 --> 00:19:50.544
If their roof leaks, if their AC goes out, if plumbing breaks, if their toilet flapper goes bad and he's replaced whatever all the normal stuff, it's their home.

00:19:50.723 --> 00:19:51.233
They own it.

00:19:51.233 --> 00:19:54.384
They call the vendor just like you would if you owned a single family home, right?

00:19:54.713 --> 00:20:01.463
They call and they get it fixed and basically they're paying us the the, a fee on a monthly basis to rent the lot that, that their home sits on.

00:20:01.463 --> 00:20:08.753
And a lot low lower maintenance and management intensity than that of of managing an apartment complex of the same size.

00:20:08.753 --> 00:20:10.554
So that's a huge one.

00:20:10.554 --> 00:20:13.074
On top of that, the turnover is incredibly low.

00:20:13.074 --> 00:20:18.983
So what ultimately occurs is being that they own their home, and number one it's very expensive.

00:20:18.983 --> 00:20:23.663
The movies, 99% of mobile home leave a factory and they go to a mobile home park like ours never leave.

00:20:23.933 --> 00:20:25.673
They stay there, they get anchored into the ground.

00:20:25.854 --> 00:20:29.064
They are mobile, they can be moved, but it's a, you gotta get a professional mover.

00:20:29.064 --> 00:20:30.773
It's license, it costs a lot of money to do it.

00:20:31.134 --> 00:20:32.574
And so most of that time, they just stay there.

00:20:32.574 --> 00:20:33.203
They never leave.

00:20:33.203 --> 00:20:38.273
And so what occurs is they tend to live and breathe li again.

00:20:38.604 --> 00:20:41.064
I'll use like a single family subdivision as an example.

00:20:41.064 --> 00:20:47.663
If you own a home in a subdivision, you live there, you pay your HOA, you pay your property taxes, all that.

00:20:47.933 --> 00:20:53.574
If you decide you wanna leave, you put your home up for sale, you continue paying all those financial responsibilities until you sell your home.

00:20:53.574 --> 00:20:54.173
You sell your home.

00:20:54.173 --> 00:20:55.104
A new buyer comes in.

00:20:55.868 --> 00:20:58.088
They purchase the home from you, you move on.

00:20:58.088 --> 00:21:01.929
That new buyer assumes the responsibility now of the HOA of the property taxes, right?

00:21:02.169 --> 00:21:05.048
But there was never a point in time where the property taxes didn't get paid.

00:21:05.048 --> 00:21:07.118
There was never a point in time where the HOA didn't get paid.

00:21:07.358 --> 00:21:09.878
And very rarely is there ever a point in time we don't get paid.

00:21:09.878 --> 00:21:16.898
They put their home up for sale, they continue paying us lot rent, and a new person comes in, new buyer comes in, purchase that home.

00:21:17.199 --> 00:21:28.148
They take over responsibility of that lot rent, and we don't really have that downtime like you have in a normal multi-family property where, so you turn a unit, yeah, you've got a month or two of make ready, get that unit back online.

00:21:29.048 --> 00:21:35.919
You've got lost rents there, you've got the cost of rehab that unit to, to get it back in livable condition, which can be a few hundred to a few thousand dollars.

00:21:36.638 --> 00:21:38.348
And we very rarely ever have that.

00:21:38.348 --> 00:21:42.249
And so for that reason, it's just a, it's a much stickier resident base.

00:21:42.699 --> 00:21:45.219
Lot lower turnover and lot lower management costs.

00:21:46.209 --> 00:21:47.378
We've got a number of residents.

00:21:47.949 --> 00:21:49.808
We've got about 3,500 lots in our ownership.

00:21:49.808 --> 00:21:56.078
And, there's probably a few hundred of them that have lived in our communities for more than 20 years that haven't moved.

00:21:56.078 --> 00:21:56.169
Wow.

00:21:56.169 --> 00:22:00.999
And we've got a few residents that I know that come to mind that have reside there for over 40 years.

00:22:00.999 --> 00:22:02.259
So Wow.

00:22:02.979 --> 00:22:04.628
Very sticky resident base to them.

00:22:04.628 --> 00:22:06.519
It's their subdivision, it's their neighborhood.

00:22:07.179 --> 00:22:13.388
And we've got a number of communities where there's multiple family members that live in that neighborhood that live in that same community.

00:22:13.778 --> 00:22:16.689
And so they stay that's their home.

00:22:16.689 --> 00:22:21.459
That's where they live and that's where they wanna raise their kids, their grandchildren, their, there's aunts and uncles and all that living in the same community.

00:22:21.459 --> 00:22:23.318
So it's just a, it's a beautiful space.

00:22:23.528 --> 00:22:25.449
Or it's a, beautiful investment and.

00:22:26.153 --> 00:22:32.693
Again, it gives us, it's we do, we could do well financially while also doing well socially.

00:22:32.693 --> 00:22:40.013
Like we can offer a great product, an affordable price, and then also on, on the investment side, make good money doing so.

00:22:40.104 --> 00:22:41.183
So it's a beautiful thing.

00:22:41.483 --> 00:22:41.784
Yeah.

00:22:41.784 --> 00:22:43.284
It seems like the best of all worlds.

00:22:43.523 --> 00:22:47.903
You got less maintenance, longer term tenants that have pride of ownership.

00:22:48.894 --> 00:22:49.104
Yeah.

00:22:49.433 --> 00:22:53.784
It sounds like best of all worlds, right?

00:22:53.874 --> 00:22:54.114
Yeah.

00:22:54.503 --> 00:22:59.544
I see there's I don't, want, I don't wanna paint as though there's never, challenges.

00:23:00.144 --> 00:23:11.874
So some of the in interesting aspects of the business, we're value add guys and so we like to go in and be able to identify problems that we feel can be fixed and that we can do it better.

00:23:12.804 --> 00:23:13.884
So I'll give you an example.

00:23:14.304 --> 00:23:16.193
A lot of these parks they were built.

00:23:17.078 --> 00:23:18.249
40, 50 years ago.

00:23:18.969 --> 00:23:23.769
We've actually acquired many from original owners that have developed them 40, 50 years ago.

00:23:24.189 --> 00:23:32.618
And then we'll go in and what we have found is that a lot of these old, older owners, they tend to, at some point in time, they stop putting money back into these properties.

00:23:33.969 --> 00:23:36.219
They tend to degrade.

00:23:36.368 --> 00:23:37.898
They let the roads get messed up.

00:23:37.898 --> 00:23:41.409
Amenities or playgrounds tend to fall in disrepair.

00:23:41.409 --> 00:23:46.538
Just, slowly, they deteriorate over a period of years or decades.

00:23:47.169 --> 00:23:52.898
And what ultimately occurs when that happens, sometimes folks do start moving their homes out.

00:23:52.898 --> 00:23:55.568
They're like, man, okay I don't wanna live here.

00:23:55.568 --> 00:23:56.499
They're not taking care of this place.

00:23:56.499 --> 00:23:57.818
I'm gonna move my mobile home somewhere else.

00:23:57.818 --> 00:24:06.429
Like I said, it's expensive to move'em, but like you give a resident enough of a compelling reason to do meaning I'm not taking care of the neighbor, we're not putting money back in, everything's broken.

00:24:06.489 --> 00:24:07.298
They're gonna move it, right?

00:24:07.298 --> 00:24:07.358
Yeah.

00:24:07.358 --> 00:24:09.159
So we'll go in and buy a community.

00:24:09.669 --> 00:24:10.659
It might be a hundred lots.

00:24:11.874 --> 00:24:15.384
And it might only have 70 of those, 70 of those a hundred lots occupied with homes.

00:24:15.894 --> 00:24:20.213
And so the challenge then is filling in those remaining 30.

00:24:20.213 --> 00:24:34.193
And so it's what some of the business that is there's an opportunity, but it's also very capital intensive and there's logistics involved is that we'll go basically buy 30 brand new homes over a period of time, and then you'll run the logistics of bring these homes in installing that.

00:24:34.509 --> 00:24:41.169
And then we have a whole sales basically think about a new a home sales lot, right?

00:24:41.169 --> 00:24:53.469
Like we basically put these homes in and then have to go, we have a full blown sales program in house and have to sell these units, find folks come in get'em financing lined up and, ultimately help them, acquire that home.

00:24:53.469 --> 00:24:57.128
So there's some moving parts there in order, it's not all, it's not all easy breezy.

00:24:57.128 --> 00:24:59.138
These homes never leave a hundred percent occupy when we buy'em.

00:24:59.348 --> 00:25:06.068
Sometimes we have to go through some more difficult value add strategies such as that in order to really extract all the value outta the community.

00:25:07.419 --> 00:25:07.929
Interesting.

00:25:08.828 --> 00:25:11.078
What about the, parking lot?

00:25:11.348 --> 00:25:12.578
What, does that business look like?

00:25:13.598 --> 00:25:14.828
Yeah, that's a great question.

00:25:16.479 --> 00:25:20.409
A similar story in that I'd never met, I never knew anyone or met anyone that owned a parking lot.

00:25:20.409 --> 00:25:28.538
And I've been running a podcast now for about 11 years and on that podcast I interviewed a lot of guys that are in different forms of commercial real estate investments.

00:25:28.538 --> 00:25:30.723
And about seven years ago, I interviewed a guy.

00:25:31.284 --> 00:25:39.534
That happened to own parking lots and it was an asset class and I didn't know anything about, we all have parked, we have all paid the park somewhere.

00:25:42.054 --> 00:25:44.183
Somebody owns that lot or somebody owns that garage.

00:25:44.183 --> 00:25:45.804
Sometimes it's a municipality like a city.

00:25:46.044 --> 00:25:47.094
Other times it's a private owner.

00:25:47.784 --> 00:25:51.203
But I'd never met anyone just like I'd never met anyone that owned mobile home parks.

00:25:51.203 --> 00:25:52.523
I had never met anyone that owned parking.

00:25:52.523 --> 00:25:55.584
And so when I had this interview on my show, I was very intrigued.

00:25:55.824 --> 00:25:58.193
I had a lot of questions'cause I didn't know the business model.

00:25:58.193 --> 00:26:00.473
And in theory it's simple.

00:26:00.473 --> 00:26:04.943
Someone pulls in, they pay an hourly rate for parking and they leave, right?

00:26:05.183 --> 00:26:07.074
And it's like that's a part of it.

00:26:07.074 --> 00:26:08.394
But there's a lot more complexity to it.

00:26:08.394 --> 00:26:14.003
But generally speaking, what we like about parking is we're very strategic on where we buy it.

00:26:14.304 --> 00:26:19.584
And we look at it as a a cash flowing covered land play on.

00:26:20.364 --> 00:26:22.403
Irreplaceable real estate.

00:26:22.433 --> 00:26:28.584
And an example we just closed on a parking garage 800 unit parking garage in downtown Charlotte.

00:26:29.183 --> 00:26:33.384
It's literally right across from the Spectrum Center where the Charlotte Hornets it's where they call home.

00:26:33.503 --> 00:26:33.624
Oh, yeah.

00:26:34.223 --> 00:26:36.594
Spectrum Center also where all the big concerts happen.

00:26:37.134 --> 00:26:39.354
The, obviously, say a couple weeks ago and Justin Till was there.

00:26:39.354 --> 00:26:43.193
And so our parking garage is the closest proximity to this Spectrum Center.

00:26:43.794 --> 00:26:56.544
It's also attached, or not attached, but it's attached by a walkway to the Bank of America, US Headquarter building, which they have, to they have too many people that work out there, so they have overflow parking into our center.

00:26:57.324 --> 00:26:58.554
The truest headquarters is right there.

00:26:58.554 --> 00:26:59.844
There's lots of other restaurants.

00:27:00.023 --> 00:27:01.044
It's a 24 7 city.

00:27:01.044 --> 00:27:03.653
There's hotels right next door to it, so it's a phenomenal location.

00:27:03.653 --> 00:27:08.574
But the footprint that we take up there is about two acres in the heart of downtown.

00:27:08.574 --> 00:27:10.044
Again, irreplaceable real estate.

00:27:11.723 --> 00:27:14.963
And how we look at it is, it's gotta make sense as parking today.

00:27:14.963 --> 00:27:17.453
So this garage makes a lot of money.

00:27:17.844 --> 00:27:21.503
It it's just a great economic investment.

00:27:21.983 --> 00:27:29.753
So it's a standalone as parking today, it makes a ton of sense, but we want to know that it will make sense as parking for the next five, 10 years, maybe 15, 20 years, right?

00:27:29.753 --> 00:27:37.913
At some point in time, we know that there inevitably will be a higher and better use because of the location of that real estate.

00:27:37.913 --> 00:27:43.104
So whenever cars are flying or whenever folks aren't driving their cars to the city anymore, Charlotte's very much a driving city.

00:27:43.614 --> 00:27:48.173
Maybe very different than that of just like Denver's very much a driving city, right?

00:27:48.804 --> 00:27:57.263
San Francisco might be the, opposite argument, but we wanna know that our plot of real estate today, it's lowest value is parking.

00:27:57.413 --> 00:27:58.433
It will only be up from there.

00:27:58.433 --> 00:28:00.804
It'll only be higher as something else from that point forward.

00:28:00.804 --> 00:28:03.473
And and during that period of time, whether it be a decade or two, we can.

00:28:04.179 --> 00:28:06.939
Cash flow and, make a good bit of money on the parking aspect.

00:28:06.939 --> 00:28:13.148
And then whenever that's not the highest and best use, we've got some of the best real estate in the city that we can that we can redevelop.

00:28:13.898 --> 00:28:15.009
That's our, and it's all icing.

00:28:15.009 --> 00:28:17.078
We don't underwrite, we don't underwrite the future value of it.

00:28:18.009 --> 00:28:19.358
To us it's icing on the cake.

00:28:19.538 --> 00:28:23.499
It's gotta standalone today as parking and make a lot of sense as parking.

00:28:23.769 --> 00:28:32.769
And we have to feel very comfortable that there's at least a 10 year runway, to where it'll continue being highly desirable as parking given the location.

00:28:33.788 --> 00:28:35.409
Again, just, it's another cash flow play for us.

00:28:35.409 --> 00:28:40.148
We're all about, buying stable and investing in stable cash flow for our investors.

00:28:40.148 --> 00:28:45.278
And parking is a, it's a, it's very complimentary to that mobile home parks.

00:28:45.278 --> 00:28:47.679
'cause that's pretty much the business model of mobile home parks.

00:28:47.679 --> 00:28:53.108
And with parking we can go in and we can, you, we can identify a few levers of pool, like we're value add guys as well.

00:28:53.108 --> 00:28:56.588
So using the Charlotte Garage, just using that as a, as an example.

00:28:57.699 --> 00:28:59.679
There was a, couple levers that we identified.

00:28:59.739 --> 00:29:00.818
Rally Gate one being.

00:29:01.449 --> 00:29:10.088
The rates it had, been owned by the last ownership for roughly 10 years, and it was an institutional owner and they get pretty lazy.

00:29:10.088 --> 00:29:12.638
They've had the same management company in there for the last 12 years.

00:29:13.898 --> 00:29:19.449
They get lazy, they get complacent, and they, haven't done a a market study for the last, like four years.

00:29:20.259 --> 00:29:27.878
And come to find out they're about a dollar 50 an hour on average, lower than every other parking facility in the immediate area.

00:29:27.909 --> 00:29:29.798
And it's, ours is the best location.

00:29:29.798 --> 00:29:31.929
So people park in ours first before they park at these others.

00:29:31.929 --> 00:29:46.388
And so literally just by raising the rates, a dollar 50 an hour at$300,000 of of revenue to the bottom line on that garage, like relegate, without doing anything like it's, it, alls we have to do is.

00:29:47.183 --> 00:29:51.624
Just the program the parking programs, it's literally, there's nothing else.

00:29:51.624 --> 00:29:57.324
There's no letters that have to go out, there's no cost associated with changing the parking rates.

00:29:57.894 --> 00:29:58.253
Yeah.

00:29:58.463 --> 00:30:00.624
And so that's, just one of the easy levers to pull, right?

00:30:00.624 --> 00:30:08.753
There's a number of others as well, but so some, value add pieces that we can go in and pull levers on and buy a great asset and be able to still add value to it thereafter.

00:30:09.263 --> 00:30:24.594
Do you buy them as parking spots or garages in, or do you ever buy I, where I'm going with this is, I'm thinking about right now, I think there's a lot of opportunity in downtowns across America with overbuilt office space, right?

00:30:24.594 --> 00:30:24.683
Yeah.

00:30:25.074 --> 00:30:25.973
We're finding that, yeah.

00:30:26.423 --> 00:30:30.354
So I would think that the land value might be greater than some of the buildings there now, right?

00:30:30.384 --> 00:30:32.723
So in some of these places, maybe I'm wrong.

00:30:33.203 --> 00:30:34.253
But have you evaluated it that way?

00:30:34.253 --> 00:30:34.314
Yeah.

00:30:34.314 --> 00:30:39.384
Maybe buying it based on land value, turning it down, making it a lot, or making it a garage.

00:30:40.703 --> 00:30:42.479
Is that an opportunity's a It's a great.

00:30:43.913 --> 00:30:44.364
Question.

00:30:45.263 --> 00:30:47.243
There's a couple ways I can approach that answer.

00:30:47.243 --> 00:31:03.894
And I guess number one is, as far as like buying an office building and tearing it down and using it as like a service parking lot, I a lot of cities don't, will not allow you to permit a new, like if you wanted to knock down an old building and just keep it as a pa paid parking lot, they won't allow you to do it.

00:31:03.894 --> 00:31:07.854
They don't really, they think parking lots are unsightly and also it's not a good tax basis for them.

00:31:07.854 --> 00:31:07.943
Sure.

00:31:08.153 --> 00:31:16.733
Like it's not in their best interest to allow you to knock down something that's actually got, it's got high tax value to it and basically make it into.

00:31:18.128 --> 00:31:20.409
Something that doesn't have hardly much tax basis at all.

00:31:20.443 --> 00:31:20.663
Yeah.

00:31:20.669 --> 00:31:20.888
Yeah.

00:31:20.888 --> 00:31:29.288
And that's a couple reasons why you would never just be able to, in most cities that you and I would think of as prime cities to invest in, you would, you just wouldn't be able to do that anymore.

00:31:29.318 --> 00:31:30.189
Maybe 30 years ago.

00:31:30.189 --> 00:31:36.159
You would have, and a lot of the surface lots that you see that exist in those types of areas, that, that might have had a building on'em.

00:31:36.159 --> 00:31:43.148
Historically, that building was probably knocked down 30, 40 years ago and back then maybe the zoning ordinance was, were a little lighter.

00:31:45.788 --> 00:31:56.288
But at that, as far as like building a new garage what you find is like a lot of the office buildings, if they're in prime downtown locations, they were, there's some type of parking that was associated with them.

00:31:56.288 --> 00:31:58.239
Either it was parking that was built.

00:31:58.884 --> 00:32:02.394
Literally on the, maybe the first 20 floors of the structure and then the office was above it.

00:32:02.394 --> 00:32:02.453
Yeah.

00:32:02.693 --> 00:32:03.354
That's common.

00:32:03.804 --> 00:32:08.304
Or it's parking that was next to it, and that parking supported the office.

00:32:08.814 --> 00:32:11.993
Highrise, that was that was, so a lot of these actually have parking.

00:32:11.993 --> 00:32:19.433
So you bring up an interesting point, and I think, there is an opportunity, and it's one that we're exploring and again, the Charlotte Garage is a very good case of that.

00:32:20.513 --> 00:32:22.374
There's a lot of distress in the office space.

00:32:22.763 --> 00:32:24.173
A lot of'em are in prime locations.

00:32:24.173 --> 00:32:25.913
A lot of'em have parking associated with it.

00:32:27.384 --> 00:32:35.453
And so I'll just, I'll walk through the Charlotte, like the case study and you get an idea of where I think it answers your question of is there an opportunity there?

00:32:35.453 --> 00:32:36.624
And the answer is yes.

00:32:36.864 --> 00:32:39.294
It's just you identifying those opportunities.

00:32:39.294 --> 00:32:50.574
So the, Charlotte Garage it's on its own footprint, however, right next to it, literally touching walls is a 180,000 square foot office building and then touching walls to that.

00:32:50.723 --> 00:32:52.433
It was a hotel.

00:32:52.493 --> 00:32:57.084
They were all on one parcel Id all underneath one loan.

00:32:57.923 --> 00:32:58.463
Oh wow.

00:32:59.034 --> 00:33:07.104
Wake Forest University vacated like 80% of the office in the last couple years, and that basically threw the entire project into a tailspin.

00:33:07.284 --> 00:33:08.663
The hotel's always done great.

00:33:09.473 --> 00:33:10.854
The garage has always done great.

00:33:11.513 --> 00:33:14.753
The office basically threw this thing into special servicing, into foreclosure.

00:33:15.743 --> 00:33:20.933
And and again, 80% 80% of they, they moved outta 8% of that office property.

00:33:20.933 --> 00:33:23.213
And it really, threw a wrench in it.

00:33:23.213 --> 00:33:27.743
And so we we came and we didn't wanna buy the office and we didn't wanna buy the hotel.

00:33:27.743 --> 00:33:28.554
That's not our business.

00:33:28.554 --> 00:33:29.903
However, it was all one deal.

00:33:29.903 --> 00:33:32.844
It was all tied together underneath one loan, one parcel id.

00:33:32.844 --> 00:33:39.413
And so we just, we, it's a very complex deal, but we ultimately got the special servicer to approve us.

00:33:39.834 --> 00:33:45.864
Revising the plat, basically creating individual parcel IDs for the garage, the office and Oh yeah, the hotel.

00:33:46.374 --> 00:33:54.054
While we were in contract and agreeing that we would get it approved, we'd spend the money get it approved with the, county, but not file it until the day of closing.

00:33:54.054 --> 00:33:56.844
So literally, simultaneously, literally recorded it the day of closing.

00:33:57.834 --> 00:33:58.433
But in order for us.

00:33:59.913 --> 00:34:00.909
To pull that off.

00:34:00.909 --> 00:34:02.858
We don't wanna buy the office and we don't wanna buy the hotel.

00:34:02.888 --> 00:34:04.358
'cause we thought there was a lot of risks there.

00:34:04.358 --> 00:34:06.098
And that's just not our mo it's not our business model.

00:34:06.638 --> 00:34:10.599
So we found a strategic partner that came in that does their big group in Chicago.

00:34:10.838 --> 00:34:12.699
They do office of residential conversions.

00:34:13.119 --> 00:34:15.338
This one just happened to check all their boxes.

00:34:15.699 --> 00:34:16.659
And they're well funded.

00:34:16.929 --> 00:34:17.949
They've got a great reputation.

00:34:17.949 --> 00:34:21.248
So we brought them in and then we found a buyer.

00:34:21.248 --> 00:34:24.099
It actually wasn't the, it wasn't the hotel, it was a land lease.

00:34:24.548 --> 00:34:28.329
It was it was just the land lease owned the hotel that sat on top.

00:34:28.329 --> 00:34:33.009
And we found something that came in and bought that land lease or, committed to buy that land lease.

00:34:33.278 --> 00:34:35.528
And so we basically had a piece, piece the puzzle together.

00:34:35.528 --> 00:34:37.179
And then at the end of the day, we got what we wanted.

00:34:37.478 --> 00:34:41.679
We got the garage at about about$7 million below current appraised value.

00:34:42.099 --> 00:34:42.219
Wow.

00:34:42.219 --> 00:34:49.509
And the middle guy got the office, he's gonna convert into 283 market rate apartments, which will, there's no parking for them.

00:34:49.509 --> 00:34:51.219
Our garage literally is attached to that.

00:34:51.219 --> 00:34:53.199
So when he builds those we'll get a.

00:34:53.873 --> 00:34:57.204
Even if only 30% of the residents have a car, they need a place to park it.

00:34:57.204 --> 00:34:59.094
Our garage is literally connected to it.

00:35:00.173 --> 00:35:03.023
And then the guy that bought the the land lease was really happy.

00:35:03.023 --> 00:35:06.744
Like he, he felt he got a good value out of it and it's a, good, stable investment for him.

00:35:06.744 --> 00:35:12.623
So I think there's a lot of, I think there's deals like that out there because of the office distress.

00:35:12.864 --> 00:35:14.543
They're com complex in nature.

00:35:14.574 --> 00:35:15.833
'cause a lot of times they're tied together.

00:35:16.313 --> 00:35:18.534
The garage will probably be tied together with the office.

00:35:18.534 --> 00:35:22.523
But I think there's, I think there's an opportunity that that, that that exists there.

00:35:24.233 --> 00:35:24.684
Anyway, yeah.

00:35:24.954 --> 00:35:25.224
Sorry.

00:35:25.224 --> 00:35:25.284
I.

00:35:26.139 --> 00:35:26.983
No, that makes a lot of sense.

00:35:27.023 --> 00:35:33.938
I thought that was a good way to maybe answer your question, but it was a great way, kudos to you for the creative way of structuring that's brilliant.

00:35:34.869 --> 00:35:53.139
I'm curious now with being value add guys you're, obviously you, seem to have a very clear buy box with the, mobile homes in the parking spaces, but you probably also getting so much exposure through your podcast to different strategies and just being a value add guy at nature.

00:35:53.139 --> 00:35:56.438
It seems like you, you probably see a lot of opportunity in a lot of spaces.

00:35:56.438 --> 00:36:10.568
So can you talk about that and, say are there other areas that you're considering going into, or if not, just what are areas where you're seeing opportunities and right now.

00:36:11.858 --> 00:36:12.128
Yeah.

00:36:13.239 --> 00:36:14.259
It's it's a great question.

00:36:14.568 --> 00:36:18.668
I think that there's there's a 1,000,001 different ways to make money in real estate.

00:36:18.668 --> 00:36:20.588
I don't think that there's any right or wrong way.

00:36:20.889 --> 00:36:24.938
You and I both know many people in the industry that do different things than what we do, and they do quite well, right?

00:36:24.938 --> 00:36:25.239
They're, yeah.

00:36:25.239 --> 00:36:26.528
Kinda masters of their own craft.

00:36:27.188 --> 00:36:29.768
However, I would say that we try to stay our lane.

00:36:29.768 --> 00:36:37.298
It's I've some people do really well, but I've, never been great at, doing many things and, being excellent at all them at the same time.

00:36:38.378 --> 00:36:44.978
And so that, that's why we, focused on mobile home parks for many, years before we ever even considered another asset class.

00:36:44.978 --> 00:36:49.568
And it took us, we ran across parking seven years ago and didn't start buying it till four years ago.

00:36:50.264 --> 00:36:51.639
And studied it profusely.

00:36:51.699 --> 00:37:12.324
And we went to conferences and met the people in the industry, tried to poke holes in the in the in the investment thesis and before we ever pulled the trigger, we try to stay our lane and stay focused and not get not get the chase shiny objects and get and dilute the focus that we have and just try to be experts at what is we do.

00:37:12.324 --> 00:37:19.014
And for us, I don't think that there's anything else coming down the, I'm not gonna say, you never say never, right?

00:37:20.364 --> 00:37:26.903
But I still think there's quite a bit of runway, in what we're doing in both asset classes.

00:37:26.903 --> 00:37:30.143
I think there's an opportunity for us to continue to scale and buy great assets in great markets.

00:37:30.833 --> 00:37:36.804
If you ask me that in five years, maybe it's a different story, but I don't see that changing at least in the next couple of years.

00:37:37.253 --> 00:37:39.983
Outside of that I love many other asset classes.

00:37:39.983 --> 00:37:44.153
I've got personal personal investment to personal capital in me.

00:37:44.153 --> 00:37:45.293
I love medical office.

00:37:45.503 --> 00:37:46.614
Self-storage is great.

00:37:47.153 --> 00:37:48.623
Traditional multifamily is still great.

00:37:48.623 --> 00:37:50.753
I think it's a sound investment thesis.

00:37:52.239 --> 00:37:52.989
Assisted living.

00:37:52.989 --> 00:37:57.909
I've got personal capital and so I've got quite a diversified real estate portfolio.

00:37:58.119 --> 00:38:01.449
It's just, it's with other guys that's their craft.

00:38:01.748 --> 00:38:03.938
The self-storage group I invest with, that's all that they do.

00:38:03.998 --> 00:38:09.219
They do nothing else other than self-storage, assisted living group, that's all they do.

00:38:09.278 --> 00:38:10.208
S assisted living.

00:38:10.449 --> 00:38:15.009
So I like to find guys that, that, that are, have a core focus on one thing.

00:38:15.128 --> 00:38:16.329
That's all they do and they do it well.

00:38:16.329 --> 00:38:18.009
And that's pretty much where we're at.

00:38:18.579 --> 00:38:19.568
Yeah, understood.

00:38:19.958 --> 00:38:20.918
What about markets?

00:38:21.219 --> 00:38:27.668
What you seem to, you mentioned Atlanta, you, Florida, Charlotte, so clearly you like the southeast.

00:38:27.668 --> 00:38:38.978
Is that you, stick to those markets or do you go all other areas or, yeah in the mobile home park space we're both in the southeast and, northeast.

00:38:39.398 --> 00:38:42.219
I think we're, in 14 or 15 different states at present time.

00:38:43.869 --> 00:38:45.309
Mostly, east of the Mississippi.

00:38:45.909 --> 00:38:47.684
Just for logistic purposes more than anything else.

00:38:51.699 --> 00:38:55.539
We, tend to stay out of, at least in mobile home parks, we tend to pretty much stay outta blue states.

00:38:55.628 --> 00:39:01.599
We do em some stuff in Maryland in the red part of Maryland, but Maryland is blue given Baltimore.

00:39:01.599 --> 00:39:05.318
But we typically don't buy New York or up in New England states.

00:39:06.309 --> 00:39:12.429
We probably would, it'd probably take an active God for us to consider buying even something out in like California, even if it was a good deal.

00:39:12.608 --> 00:39:15.039
Just'cause there's rent control issues to deal with.

00:39:15.278 --> 00:39:25.239
Same thing with Oregon and Washington and just any area that, that, is has major discussions often around rent control or currently has rent control in place.

00:39:25.239 --> 00:39:29.753
We, we steer very clear of, and so that's mobile home parks.

00:39:29.903 --> 00:39:32.813
As far as parking, wait, I'm sorry, with that.

00:39:32.844 --> 00:39:33.083
Yeah.

00:39:33.114 --> 00:39:33.954
Rent control.

00:39:34.673 --> 00:39:38.934
Considering that the, does rent control affect the land rent as well in mobile homes?

00:39:38.934 --> 00:39:39.594
Because you're, yeah.

00:39:40.434 --> 00:39:43.134
It's all dependent on the municipality or the state.

00:39:43.134 --> 00:39:53.724
So in New York we used to own in New York, in 2019, they passed statewide rent control and it's applicable to every type of residential rental housing, including mobile home parks.

00:39:53.724 --> 00:39:54.443
And so Interesting.

00:39:55.344 --> 00:39:59.963
And it's still the most restrictive rent control policy that exists in the entire country.

00:39:59.963 --> 00:40:12.684
It's yeah, it's very difficult for, landlords to, to execute on their business plan or to make money, or even put aside enough money for reserves, for major capital improvements like roads and infrastructure and things like that.

00:40:12.684 --> 00:40:15.353
So it's we we, sold out as soon as that happened.

00:40:15.353 --> 00:40:25.224
Within a year we sold out and and just really removed ourself from the problem, which the problem being the state and, their, just, their governing policies.

00:40:25.463 --> 00:40:30.324
It's just we figured there's easier ways to, to operate our business than in states like that.

00:40:31.043 --> 00:40:32.213
We tend to steer clear.

00:40:32.724 --> 00:40:39.833
As far as parking we're looking for primary markets, big cities, downtown, areas that are experiencing massive growth.

00:40:41.603 --> 00:40:49.733
I mentioned Charlotte last, or I guess in, I guess it'd be 2023, we bought a great parking asset in downtown Phoenix.

00:40:50.483 --> 00:40:57.143
Right across from the courthouse, right down two blocks from the where the Phoenix Suns play and just a core location.

00:40:57.143 --> 00:41:02.844
So big markets like that, that are experiencing significant growth are really what we're seeking for parking.

00:41:04.974 --> 00:41:09.143
They've got a vibrant urban core area in, the downtown district.

00:41:09.143 --> 00:41:12.594
And and again very livable and walkable downtown.

00:41:12.594 --> 00:41:16.253
And we're also looking for what we classify as 24 7 cities.

00:41:16.253 --> 00:41:19.494
So there's something going on daytime, nighttime, and on the weekends.

00:41:20.454 --> 00:41:31.403
We don't wanna be in a, we don't wanna be in a downtown area that literally, it's just Monday through Friday, nine to five, and then yeah, literally nothing happens at night and nothing happens on, or very few things happen on the weekend that's not a good fit for us.

00:41:31.764 --> 00:41:38.393
And on top of that, we wanna, as far as parking we want to know there's a very diverse nature of parking demand drivers.

00:41:38.393 --> 00:41:39.893
So who's parking in our garage?

00:41:40.134 --> 00:41:40.643
If it's.

00:41:42.054 --> 00:41:55.643
If 80% of the parking is coming from one particular source let's say that let's say it's an office building and then the other 20 percent's made up of transient parkers that are just coming down for the day, or people, visiting friends or what have you.

00:41:55.643 --> 00:41:57.893
Just, but 80% is like the office.

00:41:57.893 --> 00:42:00.713
I feel very and easy about office, the future of it.

00:42:00.864 --> 00:42:02.873
And so I wouldn't put all my eggs in that basket.

00:42:02.873 --> 00:42:07.523
'cause if that 80% goes away, then I'm stuck in the water with a good location, but no one to park there.

00:42:07.733 --> 00:42:09.773
And so it's gotta be very diverse.

00:42:10.103 --> 00:42:18.173
We want courthouses, we want sports arenas, we want music venues, we want restaurants and entertainment.

00:42:18.173 --> 00:42:20.514
We want hotels that need parking.

00:42:21.204 --> 00:42:22.313
And then transient traffic.

00:42:22.313 --> 00:42:23.574
So there's five or six there.

00:42:23.574 --> 00:42:26.364
That, and it's gotta be pretty diverse across all those.

00:42:26.364 --> 00:42:30.293
It's got, it can't be overly weighted with one of those parking types.

00:42:30.324 --> 00:42:34.074
So we know that if one of'em goes away, we're still good.

00:42:34.403 --> 00:42:36.114
We can backfill with the rest.

00:42:37.643 --> 00:42:40.673
And, so it's just, there's a lot of boxes that we have to check with parking.

00:42:40.673 --> 00:42:45.324
And so it's gotta be in a big city, it's gotta be in a growing city, but then it's also gotta check all those boxes I just mentioned.

00:42:45.324 --> 00:42:51.204
So it sure, it, it eliminates a lot of what could be, a great investment for us.

00:42:51.623 --> 00:42:58.284
And, maybe it could be a great location, but it just doesn't have that diverse nature of the Parkers that are using the space that we have.

00:42:59.543 --> 00:42:59.873
Yeah.

00:42:59.873 --> 00:43:00.563
No, I get it.

00:43:00.864 --> 00:43:01.793
That, makes a lot of sense.

00:43:01.793 --> 00:43:06.503
And parking is definitely not one I had thought about as deeply as you have.

00:43:06.503 --> 00:43:08.634
That's very fascinating business.

00:43:08.634 --> 00:43:09.833
I can see why you fell in love with it.

00:43:11.333 --> 00:43:11.543
That's good.

00:43:11.543 --> 00:43:18.804
Yeah, no, that's as I tell everybody this, I mean it's anything can be a cash cow.

00:43:18.804 --> 00:43:23.423
You can make a lot of money with any investment type if you understand it really and you buy it.

00:43:24.233 --> 00:43:24.653
You know what I mean?

00:43:24.653 --> 00:43:26.753
If you understand the business model intimately.

00:43:27.594 --> 00:43:29.244
You buy it at a right price, right?

00:43:29.244 --> 00:43:33.983
You buy, you make your money on the buy, but then you also have to understand how you're gonna extract the value, right?

00:43:33.983 --> 00:43:41.423
And unless you are a master of that business whatever asset class it is, whether it's multifamily or self storage, like you better be really good at it, right?

00:43:41.574 --> 00:43:51.264
Because even if, you buy it right and you suck at like the value, the business plan or the day to day and all that, then like the money you made in the buy just went poof'cause you ran it like crap.

00:43:52.403 --> 00:43:52.793
That's right.

00:43:52.853 --> 00:43:53.184
Yeah.

00:43:53.873 --> 00:43:56.963
It doesn't matter what your strategy is if your execution sucks, right?

00:43:56.963 --> 00:43:57.173
That's right.

00:43:57.199 --> 00:43:58.043
You gotta, yeah.

00:43:58.463 --> 00:44:08.423
What about I'm curious, so you, do you syndicate all your deals, you bring in a lot of, LP type investors or what do you do, We do, fund structures.

00:44:08.903 --> 00:44:10.914
And so we don't do one-off independent deals.

00:44:11.664 --> 00:44:13.074
We're currently in the middle of.

00:44:14.108 --> 00:44:20.798
Not closing out, but we're pretty close to closing out the the raise for our fourth fund, which is a a hundred million dollar fund.

00:44:20.798 --> 00:44:26.168
And so we we tend to blend a little bit of parking with mostly mobile home parks.

00:44:26.168 --> 00:44:33.128
And so we might buy 10 mobile home park assets and then one par, one or two parking deals and we'll put it in, in, in a respective fund.

00:44:33.668 --> 00:44:40.929
But we tend to, we, like the diversity across multiple different deals in multiple different markets rather than just doing standalone deals.

00:44:40.958 --> 00:44:49.599
'cause at the end of the day you can, no matter what you have in your pro forma, there's always gonna be deals that exceed expectations and just knock it outta the park.

00:44:49.778 --> 00:44:52.028
And there's gonna be deals that don't meet pro forma, right?

00:44:52.028 --> 00:44:53.768
Like they, they missed the mark for whatever reason.

00:44:53.768 --> 00:45:03.849
So we found that doing it in a fun structure allows, a mu a much easier way to counterbalance those that are knocking outta the park to those that might just be missing the mark.

00:45:03.849 --> 00:45:05.588
'cause you're ne what I can promise you, you're never gonna be.

00:45:06.099 --> 00:45:08.018
Spot on with your proforma, there's just no way.

00:45:08.018 --> 00:45:08.139
Sure.

00:45:08.378 --> 00:45:10.688
It's, it never, exactly meets the mark.

00:45:11.018 --> 00:45:15.369
And so we put it in fun structure, like it helps create the it's like a seesaw, right?

00:45:15.369 --> 00:45:23.858
Like just you, we can even it out we can put enough, get the heavy guy over here, but then, tell the girl to tell her to bring her a little friend over.

00:45:24.039 --> 00:45:27.278
Let's counterbalance this out a little bit, get a little more weight and evenly distribute it.

00:45:27.278 --> 00:45:28.869
So that's how we look at a fund structure.

00:45:28.869 --> 00:45:29.858
And it's treeless quite well.

00:45:29.858 --> 00:45:32.289
We've been doing funds for about, I guess about eight years now.

00:45:32.349 --> 00:45:33.128
Eight or nine years.

00:45:33.309 --> 00:45:33.518
Okay.

00:45:33.518 --> 00:45:43.809
So that works well I would think I've known a few guys with fund Structures who in the last few years they raise funds for multi-family acquisitions and nothing's meeting their criteria anymore.

00:45:43.809 --> 00:45:45.159
So they had to return those funds Yeah.

00:45:45.159 --> 00:45:46.358
To the investor.

00:45:46.358 --> 00:45:49.119
So I that's good to have a couple more options there.

00:45:50.139 --> 00:45:55.449
Are you finding that the fundraising struc environment now is, friendly as it's ever been?

00:45:55.449 --> 00:45:57.759
Or what, how has it changed in the last couple years?

00:45:57.878 --> 00:45:59.199
Yeah, and that's, it's a great question.

00:45:59.409 --> 00:46:01.239
It's, it is definitely, it's become more difficult.

00:46:01.539 --> 00:46:03.969
There's, and again, I.

00:46:05.244 --> 00:46:07.434
I can speak to the retail investor base.

00:46:07.434 --> 00:46:10.914
That's who our capital comes from high net worth accredited investors.

00:46:12.204 --> 00:46:13.434
It's definitely a lot more difficult.

00:46:13.434 --> 00:46:19.824
However, I will say that we've the last two years have been the, probably our two largest growth years that we've had.

00:46:20.873 --> 00:46:23.903
And and we've raised the most capital that we have in the last two years.

00:46:23.903 --> 00:46:32.273
And I can only attribute and we've worked really hard to do that, so I don't want to, it, it definitely, the money was four years ago, capital's flowing.

00:46:32.603 --> 00:46:37.313
You could literally, you could be a Joe Schmuck and put a Facebook ad up and say, I've got a great opportunity.

00:46:37.313 --> 00:46:38.364
It's gonna give you this kind of return.

00:46:38.364 --> 00:46:41.844
And that's, someone would send you money which is crazy to think that Yeah.

00:46:41.844 --> 00:46:43.014
But that, actually existed.

00:46:43.014 --> 00:46:49.403
But, after the crash happened originally, I just.

00:46:50.333 --> 00:46:58.523
I'm, I've always been a conservative investor, and so I'm just I, know that this is a long game, long or, slow and steady wins the race type thing.

00:46:58.523 --> 00:47:02.063
Like it's just, you can make big pops in real estate, but that's not the business model.

00:47:02.063 --> 00:47:02.423
It there.

00:47:02.423 --> 00:47:05.123
There's faster ways to make more consistent money than real estate.

00:47:05.543 --> 00:47:14.304
And so for me, like it's always, it's been a long, like how do you build a sustainable business, one that can like, stand the test of time and back in 2020 when rates hit all time lows.

00:47:14.304 --> 00:47:16.309
And then 20 21, 20 22, everyone's.

00:47:17.079 --> 00:47:18.159
It's a feeding frenzy.

00:47:18.188 --> 00:47:19.599
Everyone's buying everything.

00:47:19.628 --> 00:47:21.759
Lots of things aren't penciling, but they're buying it anyway.

00:47:21.789 --> 00:47:22.329
'cause guess what?

00:47:22.329 --> 00:47:23.528
Rates are gonna stay low forever.

00:47:24.128 --> 00:47:27.278
We'll be able to cash out this thing before rates go up and it'll be great.

00:47:28.298 --> 00:47:32.739
We had a difficult time making anything pencil, and so while we bought a few things in those years, we didn't buy a lot.

00:47:32.739 --> 00:47:36.009
We definitely, we had all of our competitors, we were getting bid out left and right.

00:47:36.009 --> 00:47:37.929
We weren't scaling to the moon like everybody else.

00:47:38.619 --> 00:47:44.469
And it was a difficult time internally because I just, I wondered how everyone else was doing this when we just couldn't get things to pencil.

00:47:45.009 --> 00:47:56.978
And so we actually took advantage of the market and we actually sold a number of assets in, we plucked our portfolio out and, got some top tier pricing for I felt we were not so great long-term assets for x, y, Z reasons.

00:47:56.978 --> 00:47:59.889
And so we capitalized on that period of time hoping that.

00:48:01.134 --> 00:48:04.523
When things shifted, whatever that looks like, that we would be in a better position.

00:48:04.523 --> 00:48:05.543
Ultimately, that's what occurred.

00:48:05.543 --> 00:48:05.603
Yeah.

00:48:05.603 --> 00:48:13.313
And again, I'm not gonna say that we had the master plan or the the, crystal ball that said when that was gonna happen and when rates are gonna go up and how fast they're gonna go up.

00:48:13.313 --> 00:48:20.153
But what, occurred was as soon as they started going up, 80% of our competitors got put to the sidelines.

00:48:20.543 --> 00:48:23.244
Either they were running damage control on things they over paid for.

00:48:23.244 --> 00:48:28.914
They had, floating rate debt that now they're just like in, in a tough situation.

00:48:29.184 --> 00:48:30.653
Just a litany of challenges.

00:48:30.653 --> 00:48:36.534
And so their equity dries up they start making distributions, like they lose reputation with their investors.

00:48:37.164 --> 00:48:38.034
The list goes on and on.

00:48:38.034 --> 00:48:46.373
And so during that time, and literally up until the today, we've never missed a a distribution on any of our funds that we've continued making quarterly distributions.

00:48:46.373 --> 00:48:46.463
Nice.

00:48:48.083 --> 00:48:49.704
And it put us in a really good position.

00:48:49.704 --> 00:48:59.003
And when it was when deals actually came that penciled when no one else was buying we scooped everything up and and, our investors have faith in us and.

00:48:59.963 --> 00:49:01.733
I, think again, reputation goes a long way.

00:49:01.733 --> 00:49:03.594
It takes a lifetime to go to reputation.

00:49:03.594 --> 00:49:06.143
Literally a moment to ruin it.

00:49:06.384 --> 00:49:06.623
Yeah.

00:49:06.623 --> 00:49:13.673
And and I think there's a lot of folks that just got out, out ahead of their skis and and I don't wish that upon anyone.

00:49:13.673 --> 00:49:14.393
It's tough, man.

00:49:14.844 --> 00:49:20.724
And the capital market's really just, they caught a lot of people off guard, but now it's, investors are looking for a safe haven.

00:49:20.844 --> 00:49:24.833
They wanna go with someone that's now gone through some bumps and still figured out a way.

00:49:24.833 --> 00:49:36.384
And I guess here we are, I'm not gonna say we're the only ones, but we stand out now a little bit amongst maybe the our pack of competitors that are also in our niche that just aren't doing so well financially.

00:49:36.384 --> 00:49:39.143
So it's they puts in good spot and I'm incredibly grateful for that.

00:49:39.143 --> 00:49:42.233
And again, I'm not gonna act as though like I knew this three years ago.

00:49:42.594 --> 00:49:49.673
I, was preaching it it's like, just, I think it's as long as you're disciplined which is really difficult to do and no one else is disciplined.

00:49:49.673 --> 00:49:50.333
That's right.

00:49:50.903 --> 00:49:54.804
There was many, a nights where my partner, he's the capital guy in our group, he raises, he's.

00:49:56.228 --> 00:49:59.559
I'm the acquisition and then ops, I oversee those two departments.

00:49:59.978 --> 00:50:03.548
He oversees our entire cap raise department and the finance team.

00:50:04.298 --> 00:50:07.449
And when money's readily flown, he is saying Kevin, man, he's I hate turning away.

00:50:07.628 --> 00:50:09.009
I don't want to tell everyone no.

00:50:09.009 --> 00:50:10.389
And I'm like, I don't know what to tell you, man.

00:50:10.389 --> 00:50:11.588
I don't have any deals at pencil.

00:50:11.588 --> 00:50:15.458
And so it's him and the tension between him and I, it's a really good tension.

00:50:15.728 --> 00:50:15.849
Yeah.

00:50:15.849 --> 00:50:16.809
Has always been that.

00:50:16.869 --> 00:50:19.659
It's always been a, hey, like I don't have deals.

00:50:19.659 --> 00:50:20.289
I've got money.

00:50:20.289 --> 00:50:22.208
Where say now it's a, Hey Brian, guess what?

00:50:22.208 --> 00:50:23.469
These last two years he's damnit.

00:50:23.469 --> 00:50:25.389
He's I'm like, buddy, I got deals, man.

00:50:25.418 --> 00:50:26.378
Like now they're here.

00:50:26.588 --> 00:50:28.509
And when they're here it's typically harder to raise capital.

00:50:28.514 --> 00:50:33.159
That's we've busted our ass, we've busted our ass to to bring in the capital over the last two years.

00:50:33.909 --> 00:50:40.628
We've raised, I think about a hundred and 110 or 120 million over the last two years.

00:50:40.764 --> 00:50:40.983
Wow.

00:50:41.619 --> 00:50:42.429
And it's been wonderful.

00:50:42.849 --> 00:50:43.929
Again, we've worked really hard.

00:50:43.929 --> 00:50:44.918
We got our capital raise.

00:50:44.918 --> 00:50:47.318
We've got a whole team that we built out in the last two years.

00:50:47.318 --> 00:50:49.268
So it's not just one person doing that.

00:50:49.268 --> 00:50:51.369
And we've got a, just a.

00:50:52.418 --> 00:50:54.429
Everyone's rowing in the right direction for the right reason.

00:50:54.429 --> 00:50:59.588
We've got a great, team great staff members, and, so I'm not gonna act as though it was easy.

00:50:59.588 --> 00:51:03.458
We worked hard, but yeah, you got to it's carpet diem, right?

00:51:03.668 --> 00:51:05.469
Seize the day, seize the opportunity.

00:51:05.829 --> 00:51:06.099
Yeah.

00:51:07.179 --> 00:51:07.989
No, that's great.

00:51:08.409 --> 00:51:09.398
Kudos to you, man.

00:51:09.534 --> 00:51:19.059
And you also you learned how to identify your opportunities and, how to do it right and stay disciplined by the bumps and bruises you suffered from oh eight, right?

00:51:19.329 --> 00:51:24.998
That, that was you would, I don't think you would have this now if you didn't go through that then, right?

00:51:24.998 --> 00:51:25.568
You wouldn't have.

00:51:25.568 --> 00:51:25.929
I agree.

00:51:26.199 --> 00:51:29.903
That's why I said wouldn't change a thing it was tough and, it.

00:51:30.114 --> 00:51:32.063
Again, it's just, who knows?

00:51:32.273 --> 00:51:34.884
If that wouldn't have happened, what where would I, be at?

00:51:35.213 --> 00:51:35.603
I don't know.

00:51:36.083 --> 00:51:40.943
There's definitely a lot of good lessons that, that I took away from there and it just turned me into the guy I am today.

00:51:40.943 --> 00:51:43.434
So whether that's good or bad, I'm not sure, but I feel like it's pretty good.

00:51:43.824 --> 00:51:44.123
Yeah.

00:51:44.364 --> 00:51:46.043
Think more positive than negative came out of it.

00:51:46.253 --> 00:51:46.943
No, for sure.

00:51:47.034 --> 00:51:47.244
Yeah.

00:51:47.244 --> 00:51:48.114
Kudos to you, man.

00:51:48.639 --> 00:51:53.184
On that note, if you don't mind, I'd like to switch over to our world famous Wayfinder four.

00:51:54.324 --> 00:51:59.634
Kevin, if you could give us a ha a hack that you use, this is just a life hack that you use every day.

00:52:01.284 --> 00:52:09.474
Yeah that's a great maybe it's not every day, but I've been really trying to learn this AI stuff to a certain degree.

00:52:09.474 --> 00:52:12.324
And there's just so many things that chat GBT can do.

00:52:12.594 --> 00:52:14.213
That's the most basic form of it.

00:52:15.083 --> 00:52:26.139
And even, for example, like I'll go through and I'll, write just this, I'm trying to like, try to save time, right?

00:52:26.139 --> 00:52:35.889
So we might go through and write quarterly, recently we did quarterly reports and we always write some dialogue about what's happening, property by property, fund by fund, what have you.

00:52:37.298 --> 00:52:39.938
But throw it in chat.

00:52:39.938 --> 00:52:45.728
JBT hey, like literally reword, I'm not the, I don't know, I'm not the best writer, but reword what I've put here.

00:52:46.478 --> 00:52:47.438
Make it more eloquent.

00:52:47.438 --> 00:52:52.028
Make it summarize, do a better job summarizing the data, summarizing you know, what, what's happening here.

00:52:53.018 --> 00:52:57.338
And make it a little bit more of an institutional style report.

00:52:57.338 --> 00:52:59.559
And ultimately it's amazing what it spits out on the other side.

00:52:59.559 --> 00:53:00.369
So if you just.

00:53:01.074 --> 00:53:08.273
And I think the more you do that with ai, what I have found, like it gets to know you, it gets to understand you how you, talk what your business is.

00:53:08.873 --> 00:53:14.273
And ultimately it's an incredibly helpful tool and just it's more about like, how do I buy back more time and do things more efficiently?

00:53:15.264 --> 00:53:16.313
I think AI is where it's at.

00:53:16.313 --> 00:53:19.733
And again I'm, literally scratching the surface of I don't know anything.

00:53:20.333 --> 00:53:22.643
But Chappy Chat, GBT, has been a game changer.

00:53:23.213 --> 00:53:30.414
I do think there's a lot of additional ways to to really leverage AI to just help you grow your business and just.

00:53:31.088 --> 00:53:34.088
Be more efficient with everything that you do with your operations and everything that you do.

00:53:34.628 --> 00:53:34.929
Yeah.

00:53:36.309 --> 00:53:36.728
Yeah.

00:53:37.599 --> 00:53:40.298
Right now if you're not thinking about AI as a hack, right?

00:53:40.298 --> 00:53:41.708
You're just, you're not thinking.

00:53:42.094 --> 00:53:43.264
Yeah, absolutely.

00:53:43.264 --> 00:53:46.418
And on that note it's ironic that you brought that up.

00:53:46.418 --> 00:53:52.688
I wasn't expecting, but I, just read this book like in two days called the AI Driven Leader.

00:53:52.748 --> 00:53:54.489
Now I have it right by my side here.

00:53:54.489 --> 00:53:55.599
I'm using it as a reference.

00:53:55.929 --> 00:53:56.739
Have you heard of this yet?

00:53:56.739 --> 00:53:57.219
I have not.

00:53:57.219 --> 00:53:57.548
No.

00:53:57.608 --> 00:53:57.864
No, I haven't.

00:53:57.963 --> 00:53:58.384
Oh my God.

00:53:58.478 --> 00:53:59.259
I highly recommend it.

00:53:59.259 --> 00:54:02.768
I actually just got the author, Jeff Woods to commit to come on the show.

00:54:02.768 --> 00:54:06.009
We're gonna have him monsoon, and by the time this airs, you'll probably already have been on.

00:54:06.068 --> 00:54:06.398
Awesome.

00:54:07.268 --> 00:54:15.518
And it talks about using ai, what I'm trying to figure is how to use it, how to think about it in an evergreen way, not just yeah.

00:54:15.818 --> 00:54:17.588
How edit my stuff right now.

00:54:17.829 --> 00:54:21.248
But and what this talks about is using it as a thought partner.

00:54:21.759 --> 00:54:26.079
So imagine like having a board to think about all the things you're thinking about.

00:54:26.559 --> 00:54:29.679
When you talked about your due diligence for a project.

00:54:30.699 --> 00:54:39.789
Or before you even went into a certain asset class, like parking, all of what you did to understand it and, everything to that, you decide that, okay, it's a good thesis.

00:54:39.789 --> 00:54:43.989
I'm gonna go into it, I'm gonna execute on it using AI for that.

00:54:43.989 --> 00:54:46.179
And it's not something I had thought about.

00:54:46.239 --> 00:54:51.608
And people are using it now for that too, even therapy, which is just mind blowing.

00:54:52.059 --> 00:54:54.878
It's, yeah it's amazing.

00:54:55.208 --> 00:54:56.588
I'll, and scary at the same time.

00:54:56.648 --> 00:55:04.329
I'm trying to learn as much as possible and make sure that I spend my time in the right, on the right resources to to learn how to leverage it in a more efficient way.

00:55:04.418 --> 00:55:04.869
Totally.

00:55:04.869 --> 00:55:08.318
Man, check out this book, AI Driven Leader, the AI driven leader.

00:55:09.219 --> 00:55:09.668
It's will do.

00:55:09.668 --> 00:55:11.768
It's it's just changed.

00:55:12.009 --> 00:55:13.989
It's not even a AI book to be honest with you.

00:55:14.018 --> 00:55:16.239
It's more like a strategic leadership book.

00:55:16.719 --> 00:55:17.349
Thinking book.

00:55:17.349 --> 00:55:19.418
And it, it is changing the way I'm thinking for sure.

00:55:19.748 --> 00:55:24.188
How about a favorite, just something that you like to do all the time?

00:55:24.909 --> 00:55:28.539
A show activity book what have you?

00:55:29.454 --> 00:55:29.963
Yeah.

00:55:31.733 --> 00:55:38.963
My, I've got two boys beautiful wife and we're a water family, so we spend of course, pretty much every waking moment.

00:55:38.963 --> 00:55:39.233
Not right now.

00:55:39.233 --> 00:55:40.643
It's pretty damn cold here in Florida even.

00:55:40.643 --> 00:55:45.384
But we spend a lot of time out in the gulf fishing and just cruising islands.

00:55:46.403 --> 00:55:50.574
We spend a lot of time in, we've got a property inland and we do, I grew up wakeboarding and all that stuff.

00:55:50.574 --> 00:55:50.693
Oh, nice.

00:55:50.693 --> 00:55:53.724
So I got my kids into wakeboarding and wake surfing, all those fun sports.

00:55:53.724 --> 00:55:56.273
So we just, we literally, we are water, a water family.

00:55:56.333 --> 00:56:00.173
Most of our vacations in the summertime revolve around boating of some sort.

00:56:00.173 --> 00:56:00.264
Sure.

00:56:00.264 --> 00:56:02.244
Whether it be sailing somewhere or doing whatever.

00:56:03.023 --> 00:56:03.623
That's it, man.

00:56:03.623 --> 00:56:06.083
Like we and, all of us love it equally as much as the next.

00:56:06.083 --> 00:56:15.173
And it's just been, it's been a, fun way to just take a hobby and then literally engulf the entire family in it, and everyone puts a smile on everyone's face, that's awesome.

00:56:15.384 --> 00:56:20.693
Do you have a favorite, do you prefer sailing over motor boats or, I shouldn't even have said sailing.

00:56:21.353 --> 00:56:22.313
I'm a horrible sailor.

00:56:22.313 --> 00:56:24.648
I, although I we do charter sailboats.

00:56:25.193 --> 00:56:25.943
I'm not a great sailor.

00:56:25.943 --> 00:56:27.744
I much prefer using the motors.

00:56:28.043 --> 00:56:28.313
Okay.

00:56:29.063 --> 00:56:32.693
Probably'cause I like getting places faster, which maybe I should learn to slow down a little bit.

00:56:34.583 --> 00:56:39.384
But most of my experience, I will say is revolved around motorboats.

00:56:39.864 --> 00:56:39.983
Gotcha.

00:56:40.134 --> 00:56:44.514
I do know how to sail, but I would not call myself a sailor, so I should be careful when I say that.

00:56:44.514 --> 00:56:44.574
Yeah.

00:56:44.574 --> 00:56:49.974
Because I'd literal get butchered if if he put me in the same room with the sailor he would, beat me up left and right.

00:56:49.974 --> 00:56:51.474
So I'm definitely not a sailor.

00:56:51.713 --> 00:56:52.103
Gotcha.

00:56:52.164 --> 00:56:53.393
I know enough to be dangerous.

00:56:53.753 --> 00:56:54.083
Gotcha.

00:56:55.043 --> 00:56:59.634
I dunno how to sail either, but I've been, had my fair share of time on a sailboat and it's a lot of fun.

00:57:00.173 --> 00:57:00.264
Yeah.

00:57:00.264 --> 00:57:02.603
What about a piece of advice for your younger self?

00:57:05.333 --> 00:57:05.574
Yeah.

00:57:05.903 --> 00:57:07.463
It's, one of our company core values.

00:57:08.333 --> 00:57:10.523
Enjoy the ride have fun with what you're doing.

00:57:10.733 --> 00:57:13.884
At the end of the day none of us are promised tomorrow.

00:57:14.873 --> 00:57:19.134
We're probably, I don't know how old you are, Louis, but I'm, we look like we're probably of similar ages.

00:57:19.914 --> 00:57:21.474
And yeah, you look a lot better than I do.

00:57:21.949 --> 00:57:31.344
And we, and we all we, probably know whether it's a immediate, a friend, family, someone that's in our circle that we, that's probably lost their life like way too early, right?

00:57:31.974 --> 00:57:36.923
And whether it be a disease or an accident of some sort, but again, you're just not guaranteed tomorrow.

00:57:36.923 --> 00:57:41.963
So just have fun doing what you're doing, and and just try to be in the moment a little bit more.

00:57:41.963 --> 00:57:45.233
I think we talk about AI and we talk technology and all that stuff.

00:57:45.384 --> 00:57:50.498
It's, pretty hard To, to to not lose focus a lot of times be distracted.

00:57:50.559 --> 00:57:52.298
But I think just trying to enjoy yourself.

00:57:52.298 --> 00:57:53.858
Whatever you're doing, just enjoy it.

00:57:54.188 --> 00:58:00.849
No matter what part of the journey you're in with your growing your company or business career or family, just enjoy the day.

00:58:00.969 --> 00:58:03.548
'cause again, you might go to sleep and not wake up tomorrow.

00:58:03.548 --> 00:58:07.313
So just live live every day is your last the best to, best of your ability.

00:58:07.329 --> 00:58:10.929
I know that's, such a cliche and that's hard to do, but just be conscious of it.

00:58:11.349 --> 00:58:11.619
Yeah.

00:58:11.918 --> 00:58:12.338
I love that.

00:58:14.528 --> 00:58:18.458
Last one, you can choose between a big opportunity or a limiting belief.

00:58:18.849 --> 00:58:22.298
Just pick what resonates with that and talk about it.

00:58:25.869 --> 00:58:26.528
Interesting.

00:58:28.088 --> 00:58:29.349
I don't know how to take both those.

00:58:29.469 --> 00:58:31.298
But either way I, think big opportunity.

00:58:31.449 --> 00:58:39.878
I, don't, and honestly, I just, I think I'm just generally speaking I'm a very, optimistic person.

00:58:39.878 --> 00:58:40.869
I've always been that way.

00:58:41.798 --> 00:58:42.608
Trying to find.

00:58:43.148 --> 00:58:45.039
Solutions to whatever problem there might be.

00:58:45.278 --> 00:58:47.858
And so for me that equates to opportunity.

00:58:47.858 --> 00:58:49.449
I think there's opportunities around all of us, right?

00:58:49.449 --> 00:58:51.969
Find a problem and figure out the solution.

00:58:51.969 --> 00:58:53.588
To me that equals opportunity.

00:58:54.369 --> 00:58:54.608
Yeah.

00:58:55.179 --> 00:58:57.699
Do you see any really big opportunity out there right now?

00:58:57.699 --> 00:58:58.599
Or one that you're pursuing?

00:58:59.259 --> 00:59:04.813
Yeah again, I think just, yeah, we spoke about AI a little bit.

00:59:04.838 --> 00:59:08.168
I do think there's a huge opportunity for us to leverage that in all of our whatever.

00:59:08.228 --> 00:59:13.119
It doesn't matter what you do for work, it doesn't matter for your, work or if you own a business or what.

00:59:13.599 --> 00:59:24.818
You have a literally there's so many different capacities that I'm trying, I'm literally like, I'm just at being staged, trying to understand it more to where I could integrate it into my life, into what, we do.

00:59:24.818 --> 00:59:35.708
But I do think that's probably the biggest opportunity at hand right now is understanding AI and how to truly integrate, leverage it, to just really everything.

00:59:36.338 --> 00:59:36.699
Yeah.

00:59:36.699 --> 00:59:38.858
I, everything, yeah, I literally everything.

00:59:39.099 --> 00:59:40.719
You just gotta like literally everything.

00:59:43.509 --> 00:59:44.108
That's big.

00:59:44.528 --> 00:59:46.958
Yeah, that's it's, I think it puts you ahead.

00:59:46.958 --> 00:59:54.639
I think there's probably a large, the lar, a larger contingent of the population is just eh, this stuff will pass.

00:59:54.998 --> 00:59:57.009
It's not, it's here to stay.

00:59:57.068 --> 00:59:58.778
It's not just the, it's not a blip on the radar.

00:59:58.809 --> 00:59:59.349
You know what I mean?

00:59:59.349 --> 01:00:05.018
I think those who don't adapt are gonna be left behind.

01:00:05.349 --> 01:00:05.619
Yeah.

01:00:07.688 --> 01:00:15.398
I think what's exciting for people, especially our already I don't know what it was like for you when some big revolutionary technology came along.

01:00:16.239 --> 01:00:21.608
I'm thinking the internet, social media, the iPhone, right?

01:00:21.608 --> 01:00:25.809
These are things that all happened to us in our in, in our lifetime.

01:00:26.018 --> 01:00:31.778
And, I don't know if I've always recognized it to have the potential that it did, right?

01:00:31.838 --> 01:00:33.789
Like I'm thinking social media in particular.

01:00:33.789 --> 01:00:44.378
I thought it was a this is cool, great way to touch with my friends, but there's no way to really use it for money or I, didn't recognize the opportunity, right?

01:00:45.114 --> 01:00:51.623
But, and with ai, I still don't recognize all of the opportunity but clearly I, don't think anybody does yet.

01:00:51.653 --> 01:00:59.094
There's so much, but clearly it's a revolutionary technology that I am, just so excited about now, this is gonna change our lives.

01:00:59.094 --> 01:01:00.773
We all know it, we recognize it now.

01:01:01.014 --> 01:01:04.313
There's no you can't not just ignore it.

01:01:04.344 --> 01:01:04.943
You have.

01:01:04.943 --> 01:01:09.204
And yeah, to have the attitude I think that you and I have right now about it is good.

01:01:09.414 --> 01:01:10.463
I think the momentum's rolling.

01:01:10.463 --> 01:01:14.213
So I don't care if you disagree with it or you think that we're gonna get That's right.

01:01:14.418 --> 01:01:18.204
Over overthrown or society's gonna get overthrown by robots or something like that.

01:01:18.594 --> 01:01:19.134
Maybe that happens.

01:01:19.134 --> 01:01:20.153
I hope the guy doesn't happen.

01:01:20.153 --> 01:01:27.744
But the thing is that you're just you not adapting and using it is not gonna slow down the progression of of AI being That's right.

01:01:27.983 --> 01:01:29.603
In and around us in our daily lives.

01:01:29.603 --> 01:01:30.954
It's just, it's not gonna change.

01:01:30.954 --> 01:01:31.853
It's the internet, right?

01:01:31.853 --> 01:01:32.333
I don't care if.

01:01:33.114 --> 01:01:34.793
You don't want, you don't wanna be on the internet.

01:01:34.793 --> 01:01:35.693
You don't wanna learn it.

01:01:36.054 --> 01:01:40.224
You don't, understand like the you know how to leverage it and just you're opposed to it.

01:01:40.463 --> 01:01:40.884
Guess what?

01:01:41.094 --> 01:01:46.793
That's like now we all probably have someone in our family that literally still doesn't understand like, how to get into their email.

01:01:47.398 --> 01:01:48.534
You can't even send'em an email.

01:01:48.534 --> 01:01:50.664
You're like,'cause they're like, I don't know how to get in there.

01:01:50.664 --> 01:01:59.603
It's your life would be just a little bit easier if you had just learned paid attention a little bit 30 years ago, when when email came about and you were actually young enough to actually understand it.

01:01:59.934 --> 01:02:05.304
And not saying it's right or wrong, it's just, it's part of us and it will be That's right.

01:02:05.309 --> 01:02:06.684
It'll continue to be that's right.

01:02:06.713 --> 01:02:07.673
There's no change in that.

01:02:07.853 --> 01:02:08.724
There's no change in that.

01:02:09.114 --> 01:02:16.284
It's probably I, can't imagine even when cars when the first engine and then turned into an automobile, right?

01:02:16.583 --> 01:02:18.114
Horses were horses and buggies.

01:02:18.353 --> 01:02:19.134
They were reliable.

01:02:19.134 --> 01:02:21.849
Everyone understood, I understand my horses died.

01:02:21.849 --> 01:02:22.898
I know what to feed them.

01:02:22.898 --> 01:02:29.048
Like I know that I can get hay three miles down the road, eight miles down the road, 30 miles down the road.

01:02:29.438 --> 01:02:31.509
This gasoline thing, it only goes so far.

01:02:31.809 --> 01:02:33.009
And there's not another station.

01:02:33.009 --> 01:02:34.929
It's like all the problems, right?

01:02:34.929 --> 01:02:36.699
Like you started why would I even do that?

01:02:36.699 --> 01:02:39.548
Because the horse thing, like it's EI understand it.

01:02:39.728 --> 01:02:40.298
That's right.

01:02:40.306 --> 01:02:49.298
but anyway I'm sure like we all go through those periods of aversion to new ideas and, new technology.

01:02:49.298 --> 01:02:53.168
But I think again, I think just look at the bigger picture that like, it's powerful.

01:02:53.469 --> 01:02:53.949
Yeah.

01:02:54.369 --> 01:02:55.599
Oh, a hundred percent period.

01:02:55.929 --> 01:02:58.331
And there's already a, again, just get'em gen.

01:02:58.778 --> 01:03:02.798
For anyone that hasn't like even spent, just hop on chat GBT and play around a little bit.

01:03:02.858 --> 01:03:03.188
That's right.

01:03:03.248 --> 01:03:03.518
Go.

01:03:03.518 --> 01:03:04.418
Go Google.

01:03:04.974 --> 01:03:11.813
What are 10 ways that, that I can leverage chat GBT in my personal life and literally just take those 10 things and test them out.

01:03:11.813 --> 01:03:11.873
Yeah.

01:03:11.873 --> 01:03:12.983
This and see what happens.

01:03:13.494 --> 01:03:14.903
Just get some prompts, yeah.

01:03:14.903 --> 01:03:17.813
Get, if you can't think of what prompts you need, go type that in.

01:03:17.813 --> 01:03:21.893
Google, ask that, and Google will give you 10 prompts and then go play around and see what comes about.

01:03:21.893 --> 01:03:22.733
And you'll be pretty impressed.

01:03:22.733 --> 01:03:23.094
I'm sure.

01:03:23.543 --> 01:03:24.443
Yeah, totally.

01:03:24.443 --> 01:03:24.893
Totally.

01:03:25.554 --> 01:03:31.974
I love the car analogy because I'm even thinking we bought an EV last year just with all the credits and everything.

01:03:31.974 --> 01:03:32.813
My wife needed a new car.

01:03:32.813 --> 01:03:34.914
We tried one out and we're like let's see.

01:03:35.123 --> 01:03:38.364
We only leased it because we were like, this is not going to go well, whatever.

01:03:38.693 --> 01:03:45.233
Now I still have my truck and it's a gas truck, and I gotta tell you every time I go poke gas in that thing, I'm just like.

01:03:45.403 --> 01:03:47.233
I feel like I'm wasting my time.

01:03:47.414 --> 01:03:48.583
Why am I doing this?

01:03:48.583 --> 01:03:52.813
Like, why, you know what, that's why it is, it's totally changed in just a year.

01:03:52.813 --> 01:03:53.594
I'm like, wow.

01:03:53.773 --> 01:03:54.403
I don't know.

01:03:54.943 --> 01:03:56.534
I'm not sure I'll ever buy a gas car again.

01:03:56.744 --> 01:03:57.884
And, I love my truck.

01:03:58.543 --> 01:04:02.233
Or here's another great example, but we were little, right?

01:04:02.233 --> 01:04:06.103
We still had the cars, we had to roll up the windows, yeah.

01:04:06.643 --> 01:04:08.534
Who even thinks about have rolling?

01:04:08.923 --> 01:04:17.923
If you, didn't if my kid saw a car with a, handle to raise it, they'd be like how do you, why don't the windows come down in this car?

01:04:18.733 --> 01:04:19.393
Isn't that wild?

01:04:19.393 --> 01:04:21.373
We can't even conceive that.

01:04:21.373 --> 01:04:23.713
But I remember the resistance oh, this is stupid.

01:04:23.713 --> 01:04:27.764
A button's gonna, people can push the button from outside and open the window and Yep.

01:04:28.568 --> 01:04:29.018
It's wild.

01:04:29.338 --> 01:04:29.539
Absolutely.

01:04:29.753 --> 01:04:29.813
Yeah.

01:04:30.233 --> 01:04:30.623
Yep.

01:04:30.684 --> 01:04:33.289
No, it's, we've all experienced it and Totally.

01:04:33.289 --> 01:04:35.333
And so I think it's just, again, just be open-minded.

01:04:35.393 --> 01:04:36.653
I think that's the lesson of that day.

01:04:36.653 --> 01:04:37.463
Be open-minded.

01:04:37.704 --> 01:04:38.543
Yeah, totally.

01:04:39.653 --> 01:04:41.213
Kevin, this has been a lot of fun, man.

01:04:41.393 --> 01:04:43.643
I, appreciate I've learned quite a bit from you.

01:04:43.853 --> 01:04:49.284
I you've got me thinking you've given me a little bit more shiny object syndrome today oh boy.

01:04:49.434 --> 01:04:49.884
Thank you.

01:04:50.289 --> 01:04:51.353
I know it's so dangerous.

01:04:52.824 --> 01:05:08.664
Anyways, if people wanna learn a little bit more about you, maybe a little bit more about investing in your fund or your book, or what have you how can you do yeah if you wanna learn about myself and our company, sunrise Capital Investors, you can just go over to invest with sunrise.com.

01:05:08.664 --> 01:05:10.643
You can read about current offerings.

01:05:10.643 --> 01:05:11.934
We've got case studies up there.

01:05:11.934 --> 01:05:14.603
We've got a good bit of information that you can access.

01:05:15.384 --> 01:05:18.264
My podcast real Estate Investing for Cash Flow.

01:05:18.653 --> 01:05:22.523
You can access that through that, that invest with Sunrise website as well.

01:05:23.304 --> 01:05:26.034
Also find iTunes, Spotify, and all the other places where you listen to podcast.

01:05:26.034 --> 01:05:26.813
There's a million of'em now.

01:05:27.893 --> 01:05:32.574
And then lastly, I I'm, I've got a unique enough last name bup, BUPP.

01:05:32.574 --> 01:05:35.273
And so if you just, I'm pretty active on LinkedIn.

01:05:35.273 --> 01:05:37.224
I'm active on Facebook and Instagram.

01:05:37.224 --> 01:05:38.844
And so just type my name.

01:05:38.844 --> 01:05:41.994
I'm not gonna give you the handle, but just type my name in and you'll you'll track me down pretty easily.

01:05:42.804 --> 01:05:44.994
Alright, thank you very much Kevin.

01:05:44.994 --> 01:05:46.884
This has been really insightful and a lot of fun.

01:05:48.563 --> 01:05:50.213
Yeah, look forward to sharing this with our audience.

01:05:50.244 --> 01:05:50.693
Awesome, Liz.

01:05:50.693 --> 01:05:50.903
Thanks.

01:05:51.324 --> 01:05:52.164
Yeah, man, it's been a lot of fun.

01:05:52.164 --> 01:05:52.943
I appreciate you having me.

01:05:53.153 --> 01:05:53.514
Thank you.

01:05:58.858 --> 01:06:00.628
We hope you've enjoyed the Wayfinder Show.

01:06:00.688 --> 01:06:04.949
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01:06:05.248 --> 01:06:09.509
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01:06:10.199 --> 01:06:11.458
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